TRW’s Best and Worst SHTF guns

Howdy everyone!

 

In response to your requests for more visual media in Jarhead’s Lifestraw giveaway post, I hustled out and made a quick video on shooting while moving, with me popping a couple 2-liter containers full of water with my AR while moving in the sandpit. I was pretty pleased with myself, especially since it took about 30 takes to even get to the shooting part, and so my disappointment was pretty extreme when I came home and popped in the SD card from my video camera into the ol’ laptop. Apparently my card had run out of memory about a third of the way through! D’oh! So I’ll have to redo it, but please rest assured that we’re listening!

 

I was pretty much caught with my pants down for a post, especially since I’d already typed up an article for shooting while moving. So, I thought I’d have some opinionated fun this week. I know Ranger Man did a post (listed on the top of “Popular Posts”, no less.) on his personal Top 10 when TSHTF, so I thought I’d share my opinion too… but to combat the redundancy I’m gonna throw in my choice of worst guns as well.  Mind you, at this point, it’s pretty much all academic, and of course what I think would work best for me and mine, since the S hasn’t really HTF that I can tell, but anyway…

 

Let’s get started, shall we? Wherever possible, pictures will be taken from the manufacturer’s website.

 

TRW’s BEST guns

 

 

RUGER 10/22 TAKEDOWN: The Ruger 10/22 has really endeared itself to the modern public as a classic, no-nonsense, easy to use, easy to shoot, reliable-as-hell .22 autoloader. And when Ruger introduced it as a takedown variant that can pull apart into two pieces less than 20 inches long, and be stowed in a small pouch, with magazines and ammo ready to go, and an assembled rifle ready in less than 30 seconds, they hit it out of the ballpark. These things are extremely accurate, and the aftermarket support for triggers, optics, and other snazzy goodies is bordering ridiculous. Too cool.

 

image taken from www.coltsmfg.com

 

-AR-15 VARIANTS: Bet you didn’t see this one coming, huh? The AR-15 and its family have become the media darlings of late, both in good and bad ways. However, the AR-15 has become the staple of the self-defense, prepper, combat shooting, Law Enforcement, and hunting schools-of-thought. The first models weren’t so snazzy, but the modern AR has a dazzling adaptability , excellent reliability, and breathtaking accuracy (in most) that really makes it a hugely practical arm. Toss in the fact that parts can be found/scrounged everywhere, you can change calibers from .22 LR to .223 to 7.62×39 to .300 Blackout, to .50 Beowulf and ohers, just by switching the upper receiver, and, of course, the CDI (Chicks Dig It) factor, and you have a great, and indeed practical, platform for when TSHTF.

 

-AK-47 VARIANTS: I really don’t like AKs, I’ll admit it, but I will begrudgingly acknowledge what everyone knows them for: Their insane reliability. This reliability is the reason you see them in pictures of troops ranging from Siberia to the Sudan to Guatemala to Iraq. They work, with minimal maintenance. ALL THE TIME. Fill it full of sand. It goes bang. Fill it full of muddy water and take it out in freezing weather. It goes bang. Let it rust to hell. It goes bang. You get the picture. The 7.62×39 cartridge is a great all-around caliber too, if not the most accurate in this platform. But ya gotta respect something that does its job so damn well!

 

-REMINGTON 870: I read an article once where a fella from Scattergun Technologies (I think it was) said, “870s don’t die; they just get handled to death.” And, having run the same one for about 15 years now, using it from everything from duck hunting to practical shotgun classes, I can vouch for the statement. The 870 is simply the most functional, simple, down-to-earth shotgun out there. My 13-year old son can pull mine apart, down to the major assemblies (trigger group, bolt, receiver, barrel, pump) and reassemble it. The barrels can be easily swapped, allowing you to go from a short deer hunting or home defense gun, to a great-swinging bird or sporting clays gun in seconds. You need one of these.

 

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-(ALMOST) ANY SMITH & WESSON REVOLVER: Yeah, there are other revolver manufacturers out there, but S&W still is the Gold Standard. With great trigger pulls out of the box (buy a used one for a great deal and a more-worked in action), stellar accuracy, and easy-to-find accessories and parts, these workaholics do just that: work all the time. My S&W M65 pictured above has had thousands of rounds put downrange, and the only malfunctions have been ammo-related. With different frame sizes, caliber, sights, barrel length, finish, and grip sizes, it is almost impossible to not find one that will fit your needs nicely. For extra versatility, get a .357 Magnum (you can shoot .38 Specials in it.)

 

 

GLOCK : The ubiquitous Glock has become synonymous with the terms “reliability” and “simplicity” How can you go wrong? Yeah, they’re blocky and kinda ugly, really no “soul” to them, but they do their job well…and it’s the reason why they have the lion’s share of the Law Enforcement and private market for autoloading handguns. I personally prefer the Smith & Wesson M&P series of guns, as it will go everything the Glock will do, but better.  HOWEVER – The Glock has a  really awesome thing going for it that pulls it above the pack: The Ciener .22 LR Conversion kit. In about 5 seconds, literally, you can change your 9mm (or whatever caliber) Glock into a very accurate .22 LR handgun for training and small game use. (the SIG P226 and others have  these kits available as well, but you can buy a Glock PLUS the conversion kit for the price of one SIG) Plus, the Glock doesn’t have safties or doo-dads all over it, making it very easy to learn on and use.

 

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WINCHESTER 94/92, .45 COLT: Yep, here’s an oddball one. This gun is light, easy to carry, very accurate, powerful enough for most big game at close ranges. However, where it really shines is its ability to still be effective with black powder. The .45 Colt was developed in the 1870’s as a black powder cartridge, where it served the US military for years and racked up quite a reputation as a manstopper…even with the archaic black powder loading. SO… Why not have something in your arsenal that you can MAKE gunpowder for? Seems like a good bet to hedge.

 

TRW’S WORST PICKS

 

1911 VARIANTS: Heh heh heh…here we go. I think out of any of these, this will create the most controversy. Perhaps the most beloved gun in the US, the 1911 is an AWESOME gun. I’ve built a couple, and won IDPA matches with them. When you have a good one, it’s a good one, and usually will feed most ammo through it. But when they don’t want to play, 1911s are the most cantankerous hunks of metal on the planet. I love owning mine, I love shooting it…on the range. I don’t carry one with me to defend life, limb, and property…because there’s just that constant irk in the back of my mind that says, “will this thing work this time?” Yeah, you can spend a ton of money for a Wilson or Kimber or Les Baer, but for my money, a SIG P220 does the same thing better, and works all the time. Sorry, John Browning.

 

KEL-TEC KSG: I’ll admit, this is a super-cool idea. Two magazines under the barrel, containing 6 rounds each of full-power 12-gauge ammo. Who wouldn’t want 13 rounds of 00 buck ready to go when the chips are down? Well, I’ll pass. This gun is ALL the rage right now in the tactical shotgun market (prices have SKYROCKETED…when you can find one!) , but I’ll stick with my Remington 870. The Kel-Tec is a neat, compact idea, but it’s a mishmash of mediocre ergonomics, magazine-changing levers in wierd spots…oh, and it’s HEAVY. 12 rounds of 12-gauge weighs quite a bit, especially when it’s in your gun. I’ll admit, part of me is just prejudiced against a new,  fad gun, but due to complexity and scarcity on the market (who knows where to kind parts?) I’ll look this one over then hand it back to the nice man behind the counter.

 

ANYTHING .50 BMG: Hoo boy, are .50s cool! That HUGE carrot-sized cartridge, the ability to shoot miles away with pinpoint accuracy, the monstrous, mean-looking guns. Which are all weak points in my book. If, indeed, things go sour, the ability to only carry a few of the heavy bullets in their giant magazines, (did I mention ammo is really expensive and almost impossible to find? There’s that too. Even HANDLOADING for this beast is pricey, with special equipment needed), with the 20-plus pound rifle, is a big handicap in my book. If you’re engaging targets 1000+ yards out, you have the time to get the hell out of dodge and find someplace better to be that doesn’t involve the necessity of shooting at stuff that far away. Yes, they’re cool. Yes, they have a place. But I’ll leave it behind at that place, thanks. The logistics of supporting this mean bastid are just too much.

 

HI-POINT HANDGUNS: “Hey, remember that Hi-Point I had that was accurate, aesthetically pleasing, and reliable?” said no person ever. These things should be sold as six-packs. As paperweights. If you ever wanted to buy a gun that you could practice clearing jams and stoppages with, this is it. I’d rather throw it at a target…at least I’d know it worked that way. Also see: Jennings, Lorcin, etc.

 

-COLT SINGLE ACTION ARMY VARIANTS: Boy, are these guns beautiful. They handle well, point like your finger, they’re elegant, the finish is usually superb, bordering on breathtaking. They’re available in a lot of great calibers, too! But, there’s a reason you don’t see them in police and military holsters any more. They’re easy to break, parts will break the bank when you can find them, and it’s slow to shoot safely. Why handicap yourself when, for the price of a new Colt SAA, you can buy about 5 Glocks? Sorry, but we’re in this to win this, not trick shooting.

 

Well, what do you think? Did I piss anybody off, or validate anybody’s opinions? What’s on your loved and hated gun list?

Stay safe!
-TRW

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83 comments… add one
  • Spud May 22, 2013, 6:54 am

    Nope , we pretty much think alike.
    Though when out Archery hunting, I carry a Ruger 45LC single action
    as a back up gun. Hand loaded with 10.2 grains of Unique and 230 XTP’s. Guaranteed gonna work !

    Reply
    • The Road Warrior May 22, 2013, 7:06 am

      I guess we do think alike; I carry a S&W 25-5 in .45 Colt, and my pet load is 11.0 grns Unique and a 200 grn XTP!

      Reply
  • Ray May 22, 2013, 7:07 am

    Nothing on earth is more useless as a survival rifle than an AR , They are the worst parts whores on the planet. They also have the highest rate of catastrophic failure of any weapon in history. (true look it up) The Glock/Sig SA pistols are great and all -IF you don’t mind spending 40$+ for a single mag and looking for parts made across an ocean . AS for the SAA .45 -that may be the single best firearm ever made . If they are fragile I have never seen it and I have put 1000’s of rounds through my Uberty- I have a perfectly useable Colt SAA made in 1883 ;Call me when your Glock hits 130 .That and the fact that the world is hip deep in parts for them(Y’all know the cap and ball colt clones- SAME LOCKWORK -same springs) Lets face it guys WTSHTF its not a matter of IF your firearm breaks-but WHEN. Having ANY semi-auto weapon is a non-starter for me . One made of aluminum, plastic and titanium(can’t replace it-can’t make new parts on your own) with sights that take batteries and unobtainium mags is something I don’t want near me, and that is the one thing that ALL the semi-auto fad-guns have in common.

    Reply
    • The Road Warrior May 22, 2013, 8:06 am

      Well, IMO, knowing that this is, of course, hypothetical conjecture, I think it will be easier to find Glock parts in a catastrophic future than it will be for a SAA, just based on sheer weight of current user numbers. After all, if you walk into a parts store, it’s a hell of a lot easier to find parts for an ’08 Corolla than for a’54 Packard.

      Reply
      • Ray May 22, 2013, 8:44 am

        Yep but after the SHTF will there be any part’s stores? And to the best of my knowledge more SA revolver and cap and ball clone’s have been imported over the last 50+ years that the total number of Glocks AND Sig’s ever manufactured. This won’t even count the Colt manufactured revolvers-just the imports. The total numbers of SA revolvers made and imported is just staggering . Counting the clones it may hit 30 million over the last 60 years alone. Also it is a MUCH more reliable weapon ,with fewer moving parts .Can be fixed with a screwdriver and bastard file in most cases(if not completely worn out). They never jam , have no mags to break dent or lose, and as long as you have primers BP and lead it will “take a likkin’ and keep on tickin'” Try ANY of that with ANY SA firearm and see how fast it packs up. Yes If I’m going to war , or playing on the range a semi-auto is the weapon I want. But when the grid go’s down I’ll take my Winchester or better yet my M-1903 and my best revolver.

        Reply
        • Jason May 23, 2013, 2:43 pm

          Ray,

          You raise an excellent point …. once again – must be an age thing!

          I bird hunt with a pretty high end Beretta semi-auto 12 gage & I maintain it well. However, it will jam at the most inopportune times – the shell sometimes doesn’t eject just right or other things. It is very intermittent but always seems to happen when birds get flushed within 20-30 yards!

          TRW – I have completely disassembled it, friends & gunsmiths have as well, used all kinds of different shells & there isn’t anything that can pinpoint the problem. I have an 870 & an HK 9mm for home defense & know they won’t jam.

          Reply
    • T.R. May 22, 2013, 8:15 pm

      Interesting you said that , I watched a youtube vid on a new weapon demonstration they had in Russia with the new AK12 , the guy grabbed an M16 , demonstrated how easy it was to foul up ……..then he grabbed the AK-12 , sprinkled a little dirt in it , dropped it , then proceded to fire it without problems . The russians will probably adopt the AK12 as the new standard battle rifle because the one they really want , the AN94 is way too expensive .

      Reply
    • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 2:49 pm

      I agree that you make an excellent point with the limitations of semi-auto. There are a lot less things to go wrong with a revolver or a bolt action. Point very well taken.

      Reply
      • T.R. May 24, 2013, 5:21 pm

        I would accept them as back up weapons , but their slow speed and low round capacity could get you killed in the wrong situation . If they were still practical for combat …………the military and most police forces would still be using them ……….they are not .

        Reply
        • Ray May 24, 2013, 10:24 pm

          Thing is T.R. I’m not going into combat. I don’t ever want to go into combat if I can find another way. I want survival weapons that will “go the distance” and NOT make me so stupid that I get in a stand up gunfight ,when I should run away. If I have to depend on reload time for survival ,then I have been very unlucky or bone stupid. During WW-2 the average ammunition used in combat on Tarawa , Pelelu and Iwo Jima was less than 100 rounds a day for rifle and less than 7 rounds per day for handgun. In Korea whole Divisions ran out of ammo and were over run, and in Vietnam 85% of shots MISSED. It don’t matter a tinkers damn how much ammo you put down range if it don’t connect or you are out numbered so badly that that you run out of ammo. All this is, as they say, academic . As I am not going to war with my 1903 or my Garand. I may need it to run off looters or kill deer, but if the odds are 30 to 1 and you’r not Carlos Hathcock -OR running- you done got boned.

          Reply
          • T.R. May 24, 2013, 10:46 pm

            If your in the city , combat may be exactly what you may have to deal with on a frequent basis , weather you want to or not . Yes getting out of there is always the best option ……….it may not always be an option , most of the time , its going to be a situation of being in the wrong place at the wrong time ………..the other side of that is , if you DONT buy your primary gun with the idea of going to war with it …………you done got boned there 6 shooter Tex . Yeeeeeeee Haaaaaa click……………….oh sh*t !!! ” Ya’ll wait min till I reload real quick ” ” Time Out ! ………..Ok …..I’m ready now ! ” As the article mentions , some semi autos will go the long haul under some of the most appalling conditions ………most are Russian designed , but thats their theory of weapons vs. ours .

  • Ole'Wolf May 22, 2013, 7:35 am

    On the Glock side please allow me to add… I have a G22 in 40 S&W. By swapping only the barrel out I can now shoot .357 SiG. Swap the barrel and magazines and I can shoot 9mm… AND GLOCK STANDS BEHIND THE GUN WHEN YOU DO IT. They’ve said the basic frame & slide are over engineered for duarbility and relaiablility and that design allows this swapping with complete safety and reliability. BTW- I have a .22LR slide my G22 as well. One handgun, 4 calibers with minimum muss & fuss. Kind’a same with AR, .22LR bolt allows it to eat .223/5.56 and 22LR. I disagree with you Ray, 31 years in a uniform and been in some real shitholes…an AR ain’t an AK, but I’ve shot a lot out of both and a well maintained AR beats an AK hands down in all except letting it get full of mud or sand and a piston AR goes a long ways toward catching the AK even there. Just a shooter’s opinion.

    Reply
  • Ray May 22, 2013, 9:08 am

    Yes wolf BUT; AR-15’s ARE NOT M-16,s .they very often don’t have the QC demanded of military weapons. I started hating the M-16a1 in 1975 (I didn’t think much of the “A2” ether) . I haven’t seen anything to change my mind YET; but I never shot the gas piston AR. AK’s are OK I guess ,if you want to lay down a beaten zone, They are a great weapon for jungle warfare and CQB. Not much good in a place where range and “hit the target” go together. As I said I base this all on what would work for me post-SHTF.

    Reply
    • Ole'Wolf May 23, 2013, 7:24 am

      I both understand and agree in general… that’s my “well maintained” modifier. As an armorer I make certain sure of what I buy and the parts therein. It’s like the ongoing “shoot .223 trhu a 5.56 but never 5.56 thru a .223” arguement. From personal experience involving inappropriate loud noises on ranges I make darn sure of the parts and pieces AND the what the stamp on the casing says and will in the event of TEOTWAWKI. One thing no one mentioned… from a distance both the AR and AK platforms are easily identifiable… I think you said you preferred the M1 or 1903- I gotta admit they’re a lot more OPSEC than my choice.

      Reply
      • Ray May 23, 2013, 6:03 pm

        You got that one right! Maintain! Maintain ! Maintain ! Fix Clean, Replace worn parts! and Yeh I love the fact that the bark of a 30:06 .270 and .308 all sound the same at 600 yards. Guy’s I own a M-40a1 and I’d still take my M-1903 OR my type 1 NM M-1 Garand ,with IORN sights if the grid went down

        Reply
  • JAS May 22, 2013, 9:45 am

    I feel pretty good right now. Finally I agree with someone on my choice of guns.Even though I have a Colt officers model 45, I carry a S&W mod 60 everyday (always carried a mod 36, but here in Florida the sweat was washing the bluing off). Two 870 wingmasters, 12 and 20 ga. And even though I don’t currently own one, I love the Ruger 10-22. For 22s I currently have a Browning bolt and a Ruger MK III Pistol. On a side note, I can hear the 1911 crowd just screaming. I have never had a problem with my colt, but I have always been a wheel gunner. I carried a Smith in the service and had to qualify with one at the police academy (no autos allowed back then). I have always felt the best SHTF hand gun would be a good S&W 357 mag with an optional 9mm cylinder. It would give you the ability to find ammo most anywhere.

    Reply
  • Kevin Ayres May 22, 2013, 10:14 am

    Stop sharing my secrets. Well I don’t do the AR guns cause Biden said my wife can’t figure them out. 870 OK but my Mossberg 500 turns 30 this year and has extra barrels that change quickly also. Recent trainer I took a class from had a SIG he swore had 15,000 rounds down the pipe without cleaning and his Glock had 12,000. There are a lot of Glocks in my circle but across town is the SASS and I’m sure they have a lot of parts for SAA Army types. Stick to what is out there, like a car, Ford and Chevy are easy to salvage not so much for a fancy sports car. So make sure your guns are Fords and Chevy’s. I carried a 1911 as my duty weapon in the worst part of town, area was called the war zone, I worked graves. My back up was a Glock 30 and I felt properly armed.

    Reply
  • Charles,,,, May 22, 2013, 10:29 am

    Shotgunz, rifles and pistol’s ohhh myyyyyy…. 10/22’s, awesome and I own a few, recently began using Sig Sauer 522’s(22LR), I wouldn’t kick either out of bed but I’d pick up the 522 first, 9 months into shooting with it and tweaking it, squirrel’s and bluejays fear the 522 on the homestead, serious side tho, if one does not now have a stockpile of 22lr and the manufacturer’s do not catch up then ammo will become more expensive then the rifle, a brick is already going for 75 buck’s here in the south.( CCI AMMO). In the running with yall on the Glock’s, only hope they come out with a SS model, my lazy side of humidity in the south keep’s me on a rotating oiling check. Practice, practice, and practice somemore is as important as caliber. I’d like to see a post where yall list malfunction’s you’ve experienced with different weapon’s, what brand’s won’t take certain brand’s of ammo, as in a 22lr brand I had a few brick’s of that kept stove piping, thought it was the rifle but the same happened shooting it out of Marlin 60’s, rugar 10/22’s and Sig’s 522, triple check there all pointing to the ammo, and I had an AD with a rifle due to a pin that vibrated loose causing the trigger assembly to drop to the side within the rifle allowing the safety to slip off, stuff like that to look out for would be a good post, what say ye? 2 cent’s worth for the day.!!!!!

    Reply
  • irishdutchuncle May 22, 2013, 10:47 am

    before we get into “shooting while moving” I think we need to cover field treatment for gunshot wounds. (“quick-clot” and similar products. airtight coverings for “sucking” chest wounds, etc)

    of course, a person can bleed-out from a single pellet wound if it hits a major artery…
    surviving a gun battle: how to, is worth a whole series of videos/blog posts.

    I still want a 1911, some .22’s and a “Remington” black powder .44 to go with that model 65.

    Reply
  • Lare May 22, 2013, 11:49 am

    “They’re easy to break, parts will break the bank when you can find them, and it’s slow to shoot safely. Why handicap yourself when, for the price of a new Colt SAA, you can buy about 5 Glocks?”

    Not sure where you’re getting your information. These revolvers sell like hotcakes in Cowboy Action Shooting. Parts do not break all the time, they are readily available and the revolvers are easy to repair. The guns sell new for anywhere from $400 to$1000, although you can pay more if you want to.

    On the reload front, I’ll give the Glock the distinct advantage with a quick magazine change, and if you’re in a target rich environment, you may want the semi-auto for its ammo-carrying capacity

    But if you think these SAA-type revolvers are dangerous to shoot quickly, I recommend you do a web search on Cowboy Action Shooting (CAS) or SASS (Single Action Shooting Society). With very little practice you can empty a revolver in a couple seconds at multiple targets and hit what you’re aiming at.

    If you want some fun and practice, join a CAS club and SASS, pick out a cowboy alias, dress up like you live in the late 1800’s and spend the weekend outdoors in an Old West-style “town” shooting steel targets with like-minded folks.

    A single data point on the Hi-Point: 40 cal shooting cheap Winchester white box ammo, I’ve had maybe 5 Fail to Feed that were quickly cleared out of about 2,800 rounds. Ugly as sin and I use it as a boat anchor during fishing season. Clean it, oil it and back to the range and it goes “bang” when you pull the trigger. Sights are awesome. If you need a gun and have very little money, it’s a place to start.

    Reply
    • Anonymous May 22, 2013, 6:40 pm

      I bought a Hi Point in .45 ACP last summer….maybe I’m just lucky but after 500 rounds I haven’t had a single malfunction. I agree that they are terminally ugly but this is the kind of gun you won’t think twice about throwing in the bottom of a tool box or tackle box (something I would never think of doing with my Para 1911). They take standard 1911 magazines after the mags undergo a slight alteration. I got a couple of 15 round single stacks for mine….with a 15 rounder in place the gun goes from ugly to just plain bizarre looking. Also Hi Points come with a lifetime warranty. Would I trust my life to this pistol….no, but if money is in short supply or you need something to throw in the tackle box….you could do far worse with other brands.

      Reply
      • anonymous 2 May 25, 2013, 11:19 pm

        I have a high point in 9mm and the carbine version. I’ve also got a few friends who have em. While i dont carry one because they are ugly as sin and heavy as hell, they’ll eat anything. I don’t know of anyone who has had to use the lifetime warranty.

        Reply
  • The Road Warrior May 22, 2013, 12:11 pm

    Lare, I was really talking about a new Colt SAA (not the “Cowboy” model) and really any 2nd or 3rd generation Colt SAA that START at $2500 on, say, Gunsamerica.com. I.realize I made a sweeping generalization about the SAA market on price.

    As for safety, yes, you CAN safely shoot a SAA quickly, I’ve watched SASS meets, and they are simply awesome. I just know I’ve seen enough shredded hands from watching people trying to fan their SAAs to warrant calling it “dangerous”. One guy did it on a New Frontier, caught his palm on the rear sight. Yeowch! If you GOTTA shoot that fast, get a DA revolver, in my book. Just my opinion…but I do have nothing but utter respect for the guys who can kick ass with generations-old gear.

    I do NOT include the Ruger Blackhawk/Super Blackhawk/Vaquero and Freedom Arms revolvers in the parts criticism; they were re-engineered to be stronger, and they definitely are.

    Reply
  • riverrider May 22, 2013, 12:39 pm

    in defense of the 50 cal, in defense its the bomb! what else will pop a hole in the dhs’s fancy armored cars? or take out a whirlybird? or smash thru a sandbag fighting position, or that 20 inch pine that the badguy is trying to get skinny behind? what else will stop that guy on the dozer thats intent on flattening your home? what else is garranteed to shut down an engine or light up a fuel tank? btw, ammo runs from two to three dollars a round and i have multiple sources as well as a nice stockpile. the dif rounds make it a veratile gun. besides, you can get ammo from the dhs when the time comes. a 20 pound rifle still totes easier than an 80 lb ma-deuce. if ya got the cash the fifty is a good return on investment. i got mine for less than some folks paid for a post november ar15.

    Reply
    • Jason May 23, 2013, 2:56 pm

      River, if you haven’t seen this, it gives a great demo of the punching power of the 50 cal.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JK2P70K4c94

      Reply
      • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 2:59 pm

        Now all you have to do is take out a second mortgage on your house to buy a little ammo for that .50 cal.

        Reply
        • Jason May 23, 2013, 4:54 pm

          It’s just like buying a printer for the computer – the replacement ink costs a bucket!

          Reply
          • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 5:00 pm

            Dude, at $2 a round it’s not a bucket it’s a frickin ocean-going container ship. Don’t get me wrong, I fired an M2 several times in the Army, and it was the most fun you could have with your clothes on. In fact, it was so much fun it rivaled the kind of fun you can have stark naked with the right company, but as a civilian hobby, I’ll stick with the .50 cal I got in my pocket (and the right company).

          • Jason May 23, 2013, 8:56 pm

            I was laughing out loud with your response – it killed me!

          • Jarhead Survivor May 24, 2013, 10:55 am

            @Semper. Too funny!

            I shot the Ma Deuce many times in the corps and I loved it. You could shoot down a city block with enough ammo. Of course I wouldn’t want to foot the bill for the ammo.

            Ever seen those flying gun platforms? I think they’re called Puff the Magic Dragon. Basically a C130 with gatling guns. I’d love to shoot one of those sometime!

          • Semper Paratus May 24, 2013, 2:50 pm

            Oh yeah, I’ve seen Puff in action in the Gulf. If I were enemy and I saw that thing coming at me I would run as fast as I was able with my shorts full of my reaction to seeing it.

  • Waterboy May 22, 2013, 1:08 pm

    Agree with you on the long guns, not so much on the hand guns. I own Sigs in multiple calibers and love them. I really like the Springfield XD line and own some. Not so much a Glock fan. Maybe just going against the grain, not too sure on that…

    Reply
  • j.r. guerra in s. tx. May 22, 2013, 2:00 pm

    I’d never considered the .45LC load in BLACKPOWDER, that is a handy backup plan.

    Combination guns – in my book GOOD! Whether rimfire / shotgun or centerfire / shotgun, these make a lot of sense if you are planning on foraging wildlife. Many of us have experience seeing a big game animal while bird hunting or rabbit when deer hunting – combinations give you and option.

    Consider the .410. Hunting will become much different and shooting at still or perched game (pot shots) will become much more common. Large bored shotguns may contain too much shot and destroy too much meat. The .410 has much less shot and does less meat damage. Too, reloading those will stretch your supply of shot quite a bit, at least tripling it. Not so much for self defense, but for food – the .410 has potential.

    Deer rifle used to be spelled ‘thutty thutty’. Considered old fashioned, those lever carbines can still provide a lot of meat, especially if your location is the woods. Lever gun also does not scream ‘survivalist’.

    Reply
    • Ray May 22, 2013, 4:18 pm

      J.R. The .45 colt (AKA .45LC) was the first black powder cartrage adopted for hand guns by the US ARMY(1873) In its BP loading it will attain APROX. 1000 FPS in the 7 1/2 inch colt SAA and 900 fps in the 5 1/2 inch tube.(40 gr. of BP under a 255 gr. soft lead bullet) They had a heaver loading in 1876 (at the little big horn) than the ammo commonly used in cowboy action shooting today.

      Reply
  • expat May 22, 2013, 2:46 pm

    Well, can’t say I disagree with you on any of that. Course I don’t own any of them either.
    I do have a bunch of guns and keep some of them handy on my rural retreat. Just in case so to speak.
    My go to gun is a H&R 12ga single. I keep it by the front door loaded with 1 7/8 oz of #4 with various other loads in the stock sock. Works just fine for all the varmints I can see from the cabin. #2 is a little .38 special that weighs in @ 12oz unloaded. Small and light enough to have on me all the time. I figure it’s enough gun to keep heads down till I can get to a real gun. Kinda like every other handgun out there. The real gun is a 742 Rem with 11 rounds of 06 in it. I’ve shot it for 40 years and it kills everything it’s pointed at. I know it’s got a bad rep and there’s all sorts of cool mall nija things out there but you know what? Anybody who thinks that after SHTF they’ll be under the wagon banging away a circling injuns or shooting every living creature within half a mile is well…….an idiot and soon dead.
    Read the historical accounts of the early settlers. This isn’t going to be like war, it’s sneak up and shoot before they know you’re there, or vice versa. It’s shoot a deer (not rabbits) with one shot and hide a few hours in case somebody heard and comes looking.
    Personally I’m going to keep a very low profile and shoot almost never. If the bad guys come a calling well I’ll get a couple if I’m luck and hear em first. Most likely they’ll come at me just like I ‘d come at you. 150 grains from a quarter mile and you’d never hear the shot.

    Reply
  • Roseman May 22, 2013, 3:35 pm

    Like your lists but I’m not a fan of semi autos. I have a S&W .38sp that my wife likes and shoots accurately.
    Remington’s are great but my Mossberg 20ga is 44 years old and has digested thousands of rounds and still going. I load 1/2 oz. #6 shot for varmits and 1 oz. #1 buck for self defense plus several others loads for various purposes. The 20ga is easier for the wife to handle as she is very small person.
    I’ll stick with my Savage 99C .308 win. lever action for rifle work. I have several magazines which enables me to load it much faster than traditional lever guns and is more accurate than most.

    Reply
  • Charles,,,, May 22, 2013, 4:46 pm

    So many great gunz to choose from, now to get everyone to the range and practice, regretfully our range does not allow any move-n-shoot or moving target’s, still shooting, beyond that for everyone here, an idea to post some ideas on how to practice moving and shooting or plain hitting a moving target while still, lead etc., a bagful of helium ballons to tie on to a post on a windy day may pass the idle time… any other ideas? Other then youtube, lol….

    Reply
  • Michael May 22, 2013, 6:27 pm

    Pair that Winchester 94 up with a Ruger Blackhawk and you’re in business!

    Reply
    • The Road Warrior May 22, 2013, 7:32 pm

      Michael, I have a Smith &Wesson Model 25-5 in
      .45 Colt with a 4″ barrel that fills the bill nicely! ;-)

      Reply
  • Semper Paratus May 22, 2013, 7:48 pm

    Several people have already said this, and I’m going to agree – I hate the AR. I carried and learned to hate this platform in the Army. You call the 1911 cantankerous? Ever try to work with an AR in anything but a dry and sand-free environment? Ever been in a firefight and wish you could ask the enemy for a time out while you field stripped and cleaned it? Well I have. I will say they aren’t as bad as they used to be, but I swear Eugene Stoner was a commie whose sole purpose in life was to destroy the life’s work of John Garand. You want reliability and accuracy? Go out and buy an M1A. I know, it’s a heavy bit*h, but it’s awesomely reliable and accurate to a fault. Personally, I think the AR variants out there are only popular because they are black and sexy. Wood and steel Baby – I’ll take that every time. If you think it’s too heavy then I say grow a friggin pair and quit whining.

    Reply
    • ray May 22, 2013, 9:25 pm

      S.P. Try a M-1 Garand NM some time, or better still a M1903 that has the original SA barrel on it. Ether one of mine is sub-moa. Springfield National Armory stoped stamping the “star gauge” in the late 20’s cause 90+% of the production barrels were match grade. This was true right to the end of production. You can still find Minty M-1903’s(I have two), But they are pricy.

      Reply
    • Jarhead Survivor May 23, 2013, 2:22 pm

      Semper Paratus – Haha! Love it.

      Reply
      • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 2:32 pm

        I wasn’t a Marine like you. I was, however, a Cavalry Scout, which means I spent a lot of time pounding my feet and I learned not to whine. Hooah!

        Reply
  • T.R. May 22, 2013, 8:09 pm

    I would add , the Ruger mini 30 , its dirt simple , easy to handle and light weight . Good all around general purpose rifle . Its a good one also for people that want a semi auto but not a fussy or heavy one .

    Reply
    • Anonymous May 22, 2013, 9:29 pm

      And a Mini-14. Having a NATO chambered gun makes sense. You may be able to pick rounds up off the ground, or off of bodies after a SHTF incident.

      Reply
      • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 12:21 pm

        I have a Mini 14 and I agree with this. Again, it’s the Garand action that’s the key for me versus the AR action, which is just way too fussy. Now I will say this, the accuracy of the AR versus the Mini past 100 meters favors the AR, but I believe that in a SHTF situation, and in most combat situations, you are working within 100 meters.

        Reply
        • T.R. May 23, 2013, 4:18 pm

          I have other things for past 100 yards , 150 is past my comfort zone , plus I figure if its farther away than that …………I can just leave undetected . The mini does just fine for that range .

          Reply
          • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 6:54 pm

            Me too. If I needed to say hello at 500 yards I would introduce the target to Mr. 7.62 NATO with my Springfield M1A handshake.

      • T.R. May 23, 2013, 4:14 pm

        Thats true , but there are as many AKs out there as ARs , 7.62×39 will be easy to find as well .

        Reply
    • Michael May 23, 2013, 12:07 am

      +1 on the Mini 30.

      Reply
  • lee May 22, 2013, 11:42 pm

    I have owned 4 rugers 10-22 would never trust my life to it.

    Reply
    • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 12:25 pm

      I don’t understand this comment – a 10/22 is not a go-to weapon for defensive purposes to begin with. I think what the author here is saying is that for small game it’s perfect. Think putting food on the table, not the enemy on the ground. Would you trust the 10/22 to feed you? I would in a heartbeat. Would you want to try to hunt small game with a .223 or a .308? Not if you wanted anything left of your game after the bullet was finished with it.

      Reply
      • lee May 23, 2013, 11:04 pm

        i would not trust a 10-22 not to jam ( when people have to replace all but the recever to get a 2 in. group at a 100 yards) .
        i will keep my 67 year old winchester 74. my father bought in 1946.
        p.s. i promise i will never drive up the price on a 10-22.
        ( i thank people SAY thay like the 10-22 so thay can sale the one thay got stuck with ).

        Reply
  • Ernie May 22, 2013, 11:54 pm

    I can personally vouch for the ruger, the 870,
    and the Glock I own one of each, they are durable
    tough and fun to shoot. I would like to throw in
    the Remington 700. I have one in 7 mag I use
    for deer hunting, and while I am no sniper, I have taken
    down deer with one shot in the 300-400 yard range
    consistenly. This is one of those guns that set the standard
    and any one who is a gun enthusiast knows of
    this is one of the best. But enough talk love the
    worst list Jarhead thanks for the hard work.

    Reply
  • Jim H May 23, 2013, 12:48 am

    Some points:

    1. Let’s remember that SASS does not really test the reliability of a gun – in fact, “Cowboy” loads are nothing more than stepped-down versions of modern loads, and are lower velocity which means the gun has less stress on it, therefore lower failure rates. That being said, it would hurt like hell to get smacked with 300gr 45LC travelling at 750fps.

    2. any gun or system is only as good as the operator and the operator’s dedication to that platform. Let’s face it, if the AR15 and variants were so great, then they wouldn’t have had so many changes and additions to the system over it’s lifetime. the Garand had about a twenty year life and if memory serves there was never ANY major redesign or revamp in the design in that time – NONE, arguably it’s replacement was simply a Garand with a box mag and it’s usable life as a design is still in the military theater today.

    3. You love what you get used to. More and more people rubbing their private parts on their AR15’s because they were trained to use them in the military. Simple math. Doesn’t make the AR one bit better than anything.

    4. Parts availability when SHTF? I’ve pointed this out for years – if it DOES happen, government authority will be seizing any material that it thinks it needs, including all AR related parts and AR’s themselves. Having the same gun as our beloved rulers just means THEY have a ready source of replacements and parts, not us.

    5. Never ever got how a shotgun is useful in a SHTF situation. Let’s face it we WONT be hunting – drawing attention to ourselves with a shotgun blast for hunting is bad tactics.

    6. patrolling? Get real folks, if you’re smart you’ll get in a geographically limited area and set up hides, holes and ambush points – if you’re patrolling you’re a target because you don’t have a logistical tail you don’t have “dustoff” and you can’t call in arty on the bozo with the Mosin who’s just taken out two of your tacticool buddies in multicam. I cannot understand the SHTF conditions wherein patrolling would do anything but expose one to needless danger. Only an idiot will be patrolling, or someone trying to relive their experiences in the sandbox. When all you have is a hammer, all problems look like a nail – and just because you did something in Mosul or Crapganistan doesn’t mean it’s a good idea – remember you had to be ORDERED to do it – and too many didn’t return, or returned permanently injured. One infection will take you out, one bullet will not only deplete your available defensive firepower by a significant percentage, but it will most likely deprive your family of any hope for a safe future.

    8. why has nobody mentioned Taurus or Ruger?

    My personal choice would be:

    1. single shot 22 (fires anything including questionable ammo)
    2. Bolt action 308
    3. folding stock AK74
    4. Any glock, sig, hk or ruger semi auto.

    Why?

    1. a single shot 22 is the easiest to suppress with a plastic coke bottle that will still take small game.
    2. Any north american large game animal can be taken effectively with a .308 – and you can reach out and touch someone ACCURATELY with little training out to 500 yards without breaking the bank.
    3. C’mon, do I really have to list why an AK74 is a good idea? Folded you can’t tell I have one slung under my coat, or in my backpack – and when I need supressive firepower for some STUPID reason (like, when I’m patrolling) accuracy isn’t the biggest issue and out to 100 yards it’s easily comparable to any AR out there, further if I train.
    4. Bad things have happened REAL close to me, I need to fill the air with lead in a reliable fashion – any of those will do.
    5. Because IF the SHTF and IF I’m assaulted by any typical armored vehicle, the 50bmg will stop it – it will penetrate barriers and cover that nothing else will – if I have to take out some type of materiel support for my enemies, the 50bmg absolutely gets the job done in ONE shot – which is all I’ll have time for. I’m not certain if an up-armored HMVV will resist this round in AP – but I doubt it. At 400 yards a typical .223 round will be stopped by soft body armor – at 400 yards the 50bmg WILL penetrate the turret armor of the mounted 249SAW that’s killing my neighbors and friends.

    Thanks for letting me vent!

    Reply
    • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 12:31 pm

      Funny you say that so many people gravitate to the AR because it’s what they used in military service. My experience with the M16A1 and A2 were the very thing that soured me on them. I will say this, however – there was one upgrade to the Garand – The M14. The action is almost identical to the M1 (and the Mini 14 and even similar to the Ruger 10/22) the difference being – and you pointed this out – the feed mechanism from clip to box mag. I also want to point out that the author did mention Ruger – the 10/22 breakdown.

      Reply
      • Jarhead Survivor May 23, 2013, 2:28 pm

        I like the AR platform although I don’t own one. The only problem I ever had was it misfiring on every other round once in the field. Some problem with the ejection mechanism. I wasn’t impressed.

        Reply
        • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 2:42 pm

          You Jarheads carried my favorite battle rifle of all time and my favorite rifle I now own – An M14 (I’ve got the Springfield M1A). It’s the ultimate expression of John Garand’s vision, first issued in 1959 and still seeing service today. Now that’s a rifle with legs. A lot of you may not be aware of this, but the military is getting ready to move away from the Eugene Stoner Armalite platform in favor of a new design called a SCAR made by FN Herstal. The action has similarities to the Garand in that it uses a closed gas system. The action, however, bears little resemblence to the AR and is being promoted as a response to the fussiness of the AR to dusty conditions, which is my biggest beef with it and it’s ultimate downfall. Check it out – it’s a sweet looking battle rifle. They do sell a civilian model.

          Reply
  • Boxy May 23, 2013, 1:31 am

    I’ve got to disagree on the pistol choice only. While I love my glock, my 1911 is my EDC and has been with me for 5 years. I’ve never had an issue with it, nor the glock. I shoot regularly, probably about twice a month.

    Agree on the 870. While I like the Idea of the KSG or the UTAS-15, right now its not feasible, and well that would get heavy after a while.

    Love the idea of the Lever gun, personally I would prefer a 38/357 lever teamed with the revolver.

    My ideal setup is

    Glock 17 – 9mm – widespread usage, common round.

    AR10 – .308 – widespread, common. The reason I choose this, although heavier, it functions in both short and long range, and can be used as a hunting rifle if needed. Its Functionality is identical to an AR-15.

    Keltec Sub2k – 9mm – interchangeable mags with the glock. some people might bash this gun, I have over 1000 rounds through mine, not one failure to fire or failure to feed. The gun folds in half, making it an excellent number 2 to the 10/22. Its easy to deploy, and its easy to shoot.

    Lever Action – 38/357 – another very common caliber.

    Just my 2 cents. I still love my 1911’s but in this scenario, thats what I would have.

    Reply
  • eieio May 23, 2013, 3:36 am

    Good list and discussion.

    The Ruger 10/22 with iron sights and removable scope would be my first choice too. It would be backed up with the Ruger MKII or MK III series pistol. The rifles and the pistols would be in light weight bull barrels. This takes some work but to make them super reliable, a little bit of bolt radiusing and polishing goes a long way for function and reliability.

    As with any semi-auto platform, good magazines are probably 50% of the reason things work well or malfunction. Understanding both the gun and the magazine will go a long way in making sure things work for semi-autos when they are supposed to. Attention to function and tolerances will go a long way with these machines.

    The 10/22 and MK platforms are well made and durable. Matched with the right ammo, and if given only one gun to have, I would take the 10/22 with iron sights and Trijicon RMR dual mode sight, 25 round magazines, polymer folding stock and all the ammo I could carry in a small backpack. Or. The MKII series pistol with 10 inch light weight target bull barrel, iron sights and removable Trijicon RMR dual mode sight, magazines, and all the ammo I could carry in a small backpack. The 10 inch barreled pistol is like having a .22lr mini rifle.

    Too bad nobody makes a 9mm lever action CAR (cowboy assault rifle) in side eject format. I would buy one. I run a 9mm Glock and 9mm AR platform (accurate and reliable where they are used), but there is something to be said about a system that does not use a detachable magazine and can be topped off as you shoot. I like the fact that it is a closed breach, manually cycled action. Because 9mm is shorter that the .357 magnum round, the lever action gun’s tube could possibly hold 15 rounds. I know, I know, this is just Lever Action Gun mind theatre.

    .22lr and 9mm are short distance loads but I think they will be available when other calibers are not. (Except for how it is right now.) After that, we switch over to bows and arrows and slingshots, except for the folks who would still use Black Powder tools. By then flint or burning rope will be in short supply too.

    Develop a warrior mindset. Know your limitations. Pick your fights carefully. Tools are always good to have but I think knowledge, creativity, and the proper mindset will count more toward one’s ability to survive the hard times.

    And if you’re not in shape, there is still time to start getting into shape.

    eieio

    Reply
  • sirlancelot May 23, 2013, 2:16 pm

    10/22, Had no luck with the one i bought used. Maybe the new ones are better. No luck with aftermarket mags either.

    AR-15, Not bad. Never had to live with one in the field so will defer to those with more experience.

    Ak-47, Should have bought one of the WARSR’s back when they were $300, but not at todays ridiculous prices.

    Remington 870. I know everybody likes that cool sound, but in a stressful situation it can be short stroked. For that reason i like the 1100 or 1187.

    Revolver, Reliable, but short on capacity. would rather have 2 glocks than an extra wheel gun. ( exception see below )

    Lever Gun, If it’s all you have then it beats a sharp stick. Pair it with your S&W in the same caliber and you’ll be doing better than most city liberals.

    1911, Never owned one, but the Para-14 i must admit is intriguing

    Kel-Tec, I really like their stuff. Some say it’s junk , but have had nothing but luck with my stuff and great customer service ( yes, “not available in SHTF ” )

    50 BMG, Yeah baby ! Own the high ground. put big holes in anything that might be trouble from a long way away :-)

    Hi-Point, Never shot one. Although their little “camp rifle” gets high praise ( also wins as ugliest rifle ever )

    Single Action Colt, Really ?………………………. Really ?

    Would be interesting to see what works in a SHTF situation. Hope we never find out :-)

    Reply
    • Lumberjok May 23, 2013, 3:10 pm

      I have a Para 14….big….heavy, which helps to keep it pointed at the target. Plus with hollow points it makes huge holes in water jugs etc.

      Reply
      • sirlancelot May 25, 2013, 9:14 am

        Came across a good deal on a used one, but it wasn’t the full size version. Will pick one up if the prices ever return to normal

        Reply
    • Lumberjok May 23, 2013, 3:24 pm

      Re: Ruger 10/22. I own more than one….estimating over 10,000 rounds fired. I have found them to be utterly reliable. the key is Ruger factory mags…….the bx1 rotary or the bx25….everything else is garbage. There is a device called the Elangator which ties 3 rotaries together….or for fewer mag changes….go with the bx25…..25 rounds available and I haven’t had a single jam in over a thousand shots.

      Reply
      • sirlancelot May 25, 2013, 9:16 am

        I definitely got a lemon. Cleaned allot of lead out of the chamber. Haven’t had it down the range recently.

        Hoping the good cleaning will cure the failure to extract

        Reply
  • Jarhead Survivor May 23, 2013, 2:29 pm

    I want a BMG.

    Now.

    Reply
    • Semper Paratus May 23, 2013, 3:12 pm

      A BMG – a Big Motherf*$%ing Gun. Just what every boy needs for rabbit and squirrel hunting.

      Reply
    • T.R. May 24, 2013, 5:28 pm

      I hope a lot of folks get them , the resistance may need the extra reach and punch to deal with the growing communist tyranny from the Washington Soviet .

      Reply
    • sirlancelot May 25, 2013, 9:17 am

      me too ! But $4000 is going to keep that idea dead :-(

      Reply
    • Ray May 25, 2013, 4:50 pm

      Jarhead I just looked at one for sale -$11500 + tax ammo was $5 a round I didn’t even want to know what Mags went for.

      Reply
    • Ray May 25, 2013, 4:50 pm

      Jarhead I just looked at one for sale -$11500 + tax. Ammo was $5 a round I didn’t even want to know what Mags went for.

      Reply
  • The Road Warrior May 23, 2013, 2:32 pm

    Maybe Mrs. Jarhead will get you one for Xmas!!

    Reply
  • Fox May 23, 2013, 3:32 pm

    TRW…

    While I enjoyed your article… I found that your thoughts on the Hi-Point are mis-placed. As an early adopter of the Hi-Point C9 I have run thousands of rounds through my gun and have only had jams when I use reloaded ammo that doesn’t follow the standard ammo reload guidelines. When I used hollow points or ball ammo… no problems…

    They are American made and will give you spare parts for free … all you have to do is call and ask for them…

    Reply
  • T.R. May 23, 2013, 4:20 pm

    For those of you that own an AK or an AR , they make a stock that allows you to fire full auto bursts , you can turn off this feature when you want to ……………….just another option to have . the AK stock is called ” bumpski ” its the same company for the AR .

    Reply
  • shawn May 23, 2013, 7:49 pm

    YOU are killing me RW. My wife reads this blog and now is questioning my NEED for a 1911 (actually 2, 1 for me and 1 for her) for SHTF. All thanks to your “opinions.” Thanks bro! ;)

    Reply
  • MICoyote May 24, 2013, 12:32 pm

    How many of the guns that you listed as “worst” have you ever used?

    Reply
  • Al May 24, 2013, 3:32 pm

    No mention of a .177 pellet rifle. Not for defense, but to take small game. Cheap, lightweight, no noise to give you away in shtf.

    Reply
    • T.R. May 24, 2013, 9:08 pm

      Pump action , CO2 may be hard to find at some point .

      Reply
  • Jim H May 25, 2013, 4:59 pm

    C’mon folks think about it – saying that only a semi-auto barret is the only 50bmg gun is like saying that unless you own an original Stoner you don’t own an AR type gun. Single shot 50cal’s can be had for less than 2,000 and 5 dollars a round? We’re already paying almost a dollar a round for .223, with hopes it will go down – taking out an armored car isn’t going to take an M2 and ya’ll know it. Besides, what goblins MIGHT face .223 fire are going to have an entirely different opinion of a round that they can’t hide from behind a wall. For both psychological reasons and materiel denial reasons, the 50 makes sense. Practice? Hunters don’t put hundreds of rounds downrange before they go after their deer, most hunters I know might put MAYBE five rounds downrange before going out to hunt. Sight the 50 in, store it in a pelican case with 20rds of AP ammo and forget it, clean it yearly and it will be ready for you when/if it’s needed. I drive a used car, worth maybe 5k – doesn’t make me a better or worse driver than someone who buys a 50k car.

    Reply
    • Ray May 25, 2013, 7:59 pm

      Don’t own a .50BMG so I was just pricing . I don’t own a .223/5.56 ether, never wanted one . The big problem with the .50 is the people that use/own them. I live in a small bedroom community out side Louisville Ky. About twice a year Bubba and his buddies get together for a day ‘o shootin’. Every time they get the Big .50 out and let her rip. So far the have managed to kill two horses, (one was 1 MILE away from the rifle the other almost TWO MILES) They have killed one deer 1600 yards away and one cow THREE MILES out. The reason this is going on is that they use round HAY BALES and TREES for backstop’s. They treat it just like it’s an AR-15 . Sooner or later the Ya Hoos will kill a kid or somebody’s wife. For now no one has recovered a bullet so the ass hats are not in jail YET. You want an Anti-tank Gun , fine .But for the love of God stop thinking of it as another AR. NOTHING you see every day will stop that bullet short of a mountain. P.S. It makes a piss poor survival rifle.

      Reply
  • cz223 May 26, 2013, 9:54 am

    I have em’, or have had, most of the guns mentioned including some of the bad ones. I think that a Cowboy with a pair of Vaqueros and a good lever action in 45 Colt, make mine a Marlin 94′, would be well armed for a lot of things. I have both ar’s and a Saiga and would pick the AR up in all but the worst weather conditions. My Ar’s work and are more accurate but the AK platform would be my choice if crawling through the mud. I carry a 1911 all day every day but would strap on one of my 3 Glocks if the defication really did impact the rotary oscillator, and I felt I was going to need more firepower than my trusty 1911. I own a 10-22 and will be trading my old one in on a take-down model soon. I think that OP should have added a 22 pistol to the mix, make mine a Ruger MarkII/III. Great accuracy, great for taking small game. Love my 870 and my Mossy 590. Haven’t owned a HI-Point but I might get one just to “see for Myself” if they are as good as most people say. BTW, you can throw your Glock in your toolbox or tackle box, and it will hold up quite well to the abuse. They can’t get a whole lot uglier, can they? One last thought, if parts availability is of great concern, lets not forget that the 1911 has an almost inexhaustible supply. If your 1911 is properly tuned from the get go and you stock up on some extra parts like springs, extractors, etc. you will be good to go.

    Reply
  • R.C. May 28, 2013, 11:38 pm

    I hesitate to add my 2 cents to this conversation because of what’s been said.

    Opinions are like assholes….

    That being said, if we’re discussing SHTF, I have been changing what I own from semi-auto’s in long gun platforms, to bolts, and levers. Why? reliability, and diversity of ammo.

    I traded my semi-auto .22lr for a tubular fed bolt action simply because I can use long rifle, long, and shorts.

    I went and picked up a .223 bolt action because if I need ammo, I know there will be plenty.

    I traded my AR for a lever action 30-30, cash, and silver. That was used to buy scopes, slings, ammo, etc.

    My Mosin is clean, upgraded the stocks, and have extra money on hand to buy spares.

    As for handguns, I used to carry a Kel-Tec PF-9, but traded that out for a ruger SP101 snub in .357mag. I think it carries better (IMHO). My other EDC is a 1911. And while they are both interchangeable for my Taurus pt111 or Ruger P89, I have owned Glocks, S&W’s, Walthers, HiPoints, etc.

    I doubt I will ever nail down in my lifetime 1 gun I can say I haven’t put my trust in to save my ass if things went south. The problem (and a good problem to have, so I hope to keep it that way), is that I haven’t been in trouble where I’ve needed to rely upon my gun.

    All of this being said, it’s important at least to me, to have similar calibers, if not similar weapons in my family that should trouble arise, and we need to fight with each other, we have either similar calibers, or similar firearms. Otherwise, we will revert to Molotov cocktails and switchblade knives ;)

    Reply

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